Variable recall cooldown

[ZeeeQi]

I have to be honest here. Muolke kinda created the attention hype to the problem and solved it... there are no heroes here, but at least we got the scripts released so anyone can farm ballys now. No need to complain about scripting skills. So now its just the same problem of having more spare time. We are not all going to quit our jobs so... How about the Hues?

It's interesting you say this because this is really what it's all about. Al the fuss created recently by those that farm balrons for 6-8 hours per day isn't about anything other than they're upset that now more people can do that.

Is the problem solved? I wouldn't say solved but having more players farm that area certainly lessens the problem.

Who is upset? I haven't seen anyone upset because there are more people at balrons right now, in fact i made it so everyone can now have the script, wouldn't have done that if i care about how many people is there lol

[Muolke]

I have to be honest here. Muolke kinda created the attention hype to the problem and solved it... there are no heroes here, but at least we got the scripts released so anyone can farm ballys now. No need to complain about scripting skills. So now its just the same problem of having more spare time. We are not all going to quit our jobs so... How about the Hues?

It's interesting you say this because this is really what it's all about. Al the fuss created recently by those that farm balrons for 6-8 hours per day isn't about anything other than they're upset that now more people can do that.

Is the problem solved? I wouldn't say solved but having more players farm that area certainly lessens the problem.

Who is upset? I haven't seen anyone upset because there are more people at balrons right now, in fact i made it so everyone can now have the script, wouldn't have done that if i care about how many people is there lol

Yet you wanted 600 million for your script before I put mine up for sale for 30-40 million gold...

Why did it take me selling it for 1/20th of what you wanted for it...for you to release yours to everyone? Why do you now tell people that I scammed them by selling them a script for 1/20th of what you wanted for it? It just doesn't add up ZeeeQi. If you wanted to do a public service you would have done it before I put mine up for sale...not after.

[ZeeeQi]

It's interesting you say this because this is really what it's all about. Al the fuss created recently by those that farm balrons for 6-8 hours per day isn't about anything other than they're upset that now more people can do that.

Is the problem solved? I wouldn't say solved but having more players farm that area certainly lessens the problem.

Who is upset? I haven't seen anyone upset because there are more people at balrons right now, in fact i made it so everyone can now have the script, wouldn't have done that if i care about how many people is there lol

Yet you wanted 600 million for your script before I put mine up for sale for 30-40 million gold...

Why did it take me selling it for 1/20th of what you wanted for it...for you to release yours to everyone? Why do you now tell people that I scammed them by selling them a script for 1/20th of what you wanted for it? It just doesn't add up ZeeeQi. If you wanted to do a public service you would have done it before I put mine up for sale...not after.

Have never said i wanted to do a public service, neither that i want balrons to have 10 players at once there, i would lie if i said i wouldn't like to have the balrons only for me.

I also replied to a post of you before explaining everything (still waiting for your response), but you seem to only listen to what you want

[Muolke]

Have never said i wanted to do a public service, neither that i want balrons to have 10 players at once there, i would lie if i said i wouldn't like to have the balrons only for me.

I also replied to a post of you before explaining everything (still waiting for your response), but you seem to only listen to what you want

I only listen to the facts at hand which i've already posted.

1. You wanted to sell your Balron script for 600 million and that was perfectly fine for you.

2. I posted my Balron script for sale for 30-40 million gold which is only 1/20th what you asked for yours. I also made my intentions public via forum posts and messages to players.

3. You say that I scam players by selling them a Balron script for much less than what you wanted for yours. Even tho there's nothing dishonest or fraudulent about me selling a Balron script. As a matter of fact, Kairoz (since you brought up his name) even has a 30 day refund promise from me if certain things happen AND he also received several script upgrades after I sold him the script...since you would purposely polymorph into other creatures to make his script not recognize you and attack your mob. Talk about a scam...but it's ok because that was resolved.

Everyone is free to judge who was trying to scam and who was just trying to sell something that another player may find valuable. Everyone is also free to judge who is upset about the latest developments and who isn't...all they have to do is look at all the troubles you went thru to bring in auction data to try and paint certain players in a negative way.

[DonQuixote]

I think there are some really good ideas being thrown around. Both in this forum and the Balron Farming Solution form. But it's all getting drowned up by the feud between the 2 scripture.

I would like to read more about ways to fix the problems and less about the he said she said garbage. +C I would definitely like to thank you for the open discussion about things. I think it will bring up more ideas that are very good.

[Johnny Warren]

We are now at the point where ideas are being repeated. I stated earlier that with ZeeeQi giving out a good bally script and the attention Muolke has drawn to it, means there are a lot of players there. I jumped on this morning, Aussie time, and there were 4 players at Ballys. Nobody is making decent gold there now. Again, the problem is fairly solved at this point.

The other idea, increasing other mobs gold, has also been stated previously.

Paroxys (MagicUser) idea that if you do nerf recall you are inadvertently going to be doing the big scripters a favour is also true. As soon as nobody can recall farm, the scripters make a combination walking/recalling script and then truly get a monopoly and we are back to square one.

Probably the simplest solution is to leave it as is. The second simplest solution is to pump up gold in fel. If mobs in fel give 1.5-2x more gold, there is then incentive for players to go there and farm.

If I were the boss I would do this:

1) Change nothing to recall so I don't mess up anything else (IDOCS, new player reg buying, etc) accidentally.

2)Potentially diminish balron gold in tram (cap a single bally drop at 5k instead of 8k), leave balron gold as is in ilsh, and increase all mob gold in fel (use the carrot, not the stick to change players play styles).

3) I would put on another staff or 2 to have rigorous AFK checks that can't be easily scripted past and check with frequency. Repeat check players, if they pass once, swing back to them only 8 minutes later and check again. Have no rule about how often players can be checked, give the caveat: If you are seen script farming, you will be checked, often. As long as a player is at their keyboard, they can do what they want within the rules of the game.

4) FREE THE HUES!

Glad the thread is getting back on track.

[Dirtybook]

Honestly, I do not disagree with a single dynamic that +C has posted initially. The recall penalty, and possible mana regeneration penalty, is perfect, "as is". Reading between the lines with some of the posts on here, from players who do nothing but gold farm with a recall macro.. It seems to me, that they want loop holes. There will be no loop holes with how +C stated the possible change.. If your warping around that often, your taking an advantage of an exploit, that gives to big of a reward. The rest of the player base, shouldn't be punished by less gold on monsters, due to a handful of players that want it to easy.

Speaking for only my self here.. but what +C is proposing, will not effect players like me, in the slightest. I manually hunt. When I go some where to hunt, I fight, I Kite, I group up a mob to kill it... Then, and only then, do I recall out of the area. There are plenty of other players, that either are unaware of the warping macro out there, or they just don't prefer to use it. Many of us just want to play the game. So to the "other half" of players, like my self. I say to +C, don't second guess your self.. Your idea is perfect.

Don't ask the farmers what should be done, they will abuse any information they feed you.. I can almost 100% guarantee it.

Live long, and prosper. *Gives Vulcan Salute*

[Jebidia]

but what +C is proposing, will not effect players like me, in the slightest. I manually hunt. When I go some where to hunt, I fight, I Kite, I group up a mob to kill it... Then, and only then, do I recall out of the area. There are plenty of other players, that either are unaware of the warping macro out there, or they just don't prefer to use it. Many of us just want to play the game. So to the "other half" of players, like my self. I say to +C, don't second guess your self.. Your idea is perfect.



100% agree!!!!!

[Geriatric]

sorry dirtybook but hamstringing recall is a bad idea

people cant recall lumberjack or mine

i still knock out level 1 and 2 treasure maps, theres not much gold in, but that requires 2 recalls every minute and a half
i manually hunt as well, but there are some times where i could be casting 10 recalls in a 10 minute period, especially if half the places i go to have already been cleared out

having the balron script posted here has made a huge difference and is a dam good bandaid on the situation
i dont believe the problem is solved but but definitely in the right direction

and its not just the farmers that were asked, yet it was a farmer that posted the script and placed the bandaid
everyone was asked, open discussion and debate is one of the best way to solve problems, the ability to crowd source ideas and engage in hypotheticals

Dirtybook
Speaking for only my self here.. but what +C is proposing, will not effect players like me, in the slightest. I manually hunt. When I go some where to hunt, I fight, I Kite, I group up a mob to kill it... Then, and only then, do I recall out of the area. There are plenty of other players, that either are unaware of the warping macro out there, or they just don't prefer to use it. Many of us just want to play the game. So to the "other half" of players, like my self. I say to +C, don't second guess your self.. Your idea is perfect.

i think its very wise for +C to second guess himself, he is smart enough to know that his solution may not be the right one
his idea isn't perfect, far from it plenty of arguments have been brought up in this disccusion as to why it is not a good idea
and +C being able to take those critique's in stride is a good sign of humility
((thats how you suck up to +C rather than just tell him his idea is perfect, tell him what he needs to hear, not what he wants to hear))

[Melkor]

3) I would put on another staff or 2 to have rigorous AFK checks that can't be easily scripted past and check with frequency. Repeat check players, if they pass once, swing back to them only 8 minutes later and check again. Have no rule about how often players can be checked, give the caveat: If you are seen script farming, you will be checked, often. As long as a player is at their keyboard, they can do what they want within the rules of the game.

This is the only way to really solve it.

[Wil]

This is the only way to really solve it.

There's a reason shards don't recruit lots of admins to proactively monitor players for cheating, e.g. with AFK checks. I'll give you three guesses why, but the first two don't count.

[Kairoz]

Friends, i would like to address 2 points, regarding to what i've just read in the 2 active topics about the balron script issues. The first is a little bit personal. The second is my actual opinion about the possible solution for what +C addressed in the beginning. (You know i am not english native speaker, so i deeply apologize for my limited language).

First. I saw my name raised a few times. The ones who caught my attention were, one thing about how much i have spend in auctions in the last years, and another was me in a PM exchange with another player. Both things were very disturbing to me. Because they generate a lot of assumptions that are mostly inaccurate.
To me it was pretty offensive the idea of a correlation between gold x EDs donated in those numbers. I speak for myself. This fallacy implies me as someone who just donated thousands of euros to get to the auction prizes, which is completely false, i only donate 2 or 3 times a year, a very humble amount... that discredits all the hard work i do in this game for grinding (manually, i only got the famous balron script couple weeks ago and i dont run it too much), farming real hard, many hours per day, learning, developing my skills, always trying to feed the market with good and fair deals, specially for the newer players. That auction Data file causes a totally misconception about things, shouldn't never be brought up, totally mistake.
Also, it makes me very sad to see my words taken out of context to support ones arguments, without my previous consense. Is this suposed to be a standard practice now? To expose people with their own words with no warning? Because if it does, i say respect is totally dead toward those who do it. No matter what is being discussed, no matter who has reason or not, we must try to be respectful with one another, and preserve each others integrity.

Second I think its clear enough what is the real issue in here. The Balron script WAS something that was causing a imbalce to the economy, PRECISELY because it was something destined to belong to a group of few people who had the knowledge to build it, and for looooooooong time use it to grind unprecedent amounts of gold. Myself, i never had the knowledge for scriptting, but i also always wanted to see how a nice script works. When i had the opportunity to buy it, thanks to Muolke, i did it and don't regret it at all. But, it is clear, some people got their feelings hurt, and started this crusade to point fingers to faces and be the saviors of the economy (yes, the same people who used to earn millions a day by running it for entire daily periods, big laugh). Honestly, +C, it isnt about balrons loot or recalling cooldowns. This is about some peoples Egos hurt.

Now that the Balron Script is in the open, many players that, just like me, never had the opportunity, felt like to try it, and it is kind of funny, but it neutralizes the whole situation. With many people running the script, as it is happening now, the problem of the huge gold grinding in the hands of a few is totally resolved. It is not such a profitable practice anymore, oh, and also, people should be encouraged to use it! Yes, because, this is the whole point: many people using it, not a profitable activitie anymore, nothing to worry about anymore.

In my opinion, this situation is done guys. I am happy that some people felt like bringing attention to this, and some other people felt like sharing their knowledgeble scripts to the community. Isn't that the whole point from the start? Can we all do a big smile right now and hold each others hands? Like in the school times, we could just say sorry to the colleague and keep playing. I say, +C don't waste your time into this anymore, i'm sure you have many more important things to worry about.

The only thing that anyone should be worring now is, what do the heartbroke players will do with their fragile egos from now on that the party is over for them? I particulaly dont have any interest of knowing the outcoming of that.

[Dirtybook]

I agree with Kairoz. The situation has burnt it self out.

[Geriatric]

i still think felluca gold drops should be increased,
you cant recall in or out of those dungeons
the monsters have double the health pool
but drop the same amount of gold as trammel monsters

but i do agree the publication of the balron macro has had or will have enough of an impact on the recall farmers

[ButteryBiscuits]

So let me see if I get this right.... a dynamic of the game which has been in existence since the beginning and has been used extensively by pretty much everybody for pretty much everything somehow became the center of a "great controversy" because some people were jealous and miffed that people who had been here longer than them were able to use it to make gold in a way and quantity they could not. Every so often these discontents get together and throw a temper tantrum about how unfair everything is and how everyone should be punished for playing the game in a way it has been played FOR DECADES. After much wringing of hands and accusations that everyone who farms by recalling is a horrible, no-good, super-evil AFK scripter, +C decides to solicit comments on a 5 week plan to nerf recalling that will hopefully calm the drama down on the shard. And the funniest thing happened on the way to this small amount of players on the shard getting what they want.... most of them discovered that the "easy solution" they had been advocating for (some of them for years) was both not quite so easy and had some nasty consequences. Much of which had been highlighted over the years in lots of forum posts.

It's almost like the the people who ginned up the controversy this time were not ever really "looking out for the shard", but were looking to nerf one of the more used money-making methods here- that really would not affect them very much at all.